Documentation/registration paperwork nightmares

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Documentation/registration paperwork nightmares

Post by moore_rb »

Since so few US-market 60 model Patrols are "survivors" that have been registered and driven for their entire 40-50 year lives (Esteban's and Admiral Togo are a couple of rare birds :mrgreen: ) , and since so many today are more likely to be "barn finds" or junkyard dogs, the paper-trail on a lot of US Patrols is probably "interesting".

Plus, since all Patrols sold in the US only came with a serial number, rather than a fully coded 13+ character VIN, I know some states had unique solutions for dealing with that as well.

Do you have an interesting story about what it took to get your Patrol properly titled, and registered to drive in your home state?

Both of my Patrols have some interesting inconsistencies in the documentation. According to the serial number sequence in the US Patrol registry, my red Patrol is probably a 65 hard top kl60, and yet the "clean" Arizona title says it's a 62, which would require it to be a soft top model (which it certainly never was). I took this info (including a print out of the registry) to the Az motor vehicle department and asked them what the process was to get the model year corrected on the title, and they told me I had to have a $50 level 3 physical inspection, and that if the vehicle passed the inspection, then they would issue a new 17 digit VIN plate (that would have to be permanently rivetted to the vehicle) and then they would update the title- there is no way to maintain the L60-xxxyy serial number as the VIN if they update the model year on the title; don't ask me why- it seems quite stupid to me.

So, my red one will remain a "65 titled as a 62" for as long as I own it - Besides not wanting to piss 50 bucks away into the wind, I also don't want the VIN on the title to be anything other than the number that is stamped on the frame (and you'll see why below)

My green 66 has a very similar, VIN related issue- the Texas title does not list the L60-xxxyyy number as the VIN- The title has a long VIN number that is located nowhere on the vehicle, and so when I went to transfer the title to Arizona, I (again) had to tow the vehicle down for a physical inspection (it was a cheaper, $20 Level one inspection), but even after that, Az still said they could not transfer the title because they could not trace the Texas VIN. The fact that the texas title shows the model year as 66 (matching the firewall plate) and it shows the model as "L60" (again matching the firewall plate) they needed to see the VIN from the title, located somewhere on the vehicle, and I turned that thing inside-out looking for an ID plate with that Texas number, but it's just not there (and now you also know why I had time to take all those pictures of the many "unconventional" suspension modifications that were made on the El Paso Verde Loco machine).

So, I have had to begin the process to aquire a bonded "abandoned vehicle" title in Arizona for the Marty Robbins Ebay Patrol. I'm no stranger to this process- I think this my 5th or 6th old car I've done this for over the past 25 years.

The process involves sending a certified letter to every prior owner listed on the Texas title (luckily there is only one) asking them to get the title corrected in Texas. When 15 days have passed after the certified mail delivery window closes (Oct 6, 2013) the post office will return either the certified letter receipt, or the unopened letter back to me, and I will take it back to the Az DMV as evidence that the vehicle is abandoned by the prior owner, and then I will purchase an insured Bond against the Texas title (15 bucks); and then Arizona will issue me a new, clean title with all the numbers (model year, serial number/VIN) matching the numbers on the firewall plate.

So, inconvenience aside, I am confident that eventually the suicide deathtrap Patrol will be cleanly titled in Arizona, but this process has prevented me from busting out the tools and tearing it down until I get that document firmly in-hand.

Have any of you had to go through any "fun" processes in order to get your Patrol's papers back up to date?

And what about foreign Patrols privately imported into the US by you? What was that process like?
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White 65 Hardtop L60-3-00617 (undergoing restoration)
Red 65 hardtop 4L60-002565 (scrapped for parts)
66 Hardtop "El-Bondo Patrol", L60-00511 (Restored, then sold June2020)
Blue 67 Hardtop (sold March1997)
Green 62 Softtop L60-2-00504 (undergoing restoration)
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Re: Documentation/registration paperwork nightmares

Post by zed »

When I purchased my 1969 Patrol, the last California registration was 25+ years ago. The seller had to pay about $350 to update the registration and have California recognize that the owner on the title was diseased. Then new California plates were issued and the transfer of title could begin. Registering the Patrol in The State of Texas involved providing the new California title document and paying the transfer fee. Since the Patrol model is not listed in the DMV database, the clerk and I agreed on a value upon which the fee was based. This process provided me a title.

Once the vehicle is operable, I will have to have it inspected to obtain a registration and license plates. (I filed for the title to avoid any issues of prior owners or insurance companies claiming any rights.)
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Re: Documentation/registration paperwork nightmares

Post by moore_rb »

Keith -

Did the re-issued California title (and your susequent Texas title) use the factory frame/plate serial number as the VIN? or does your Patrol have a long VIN on the Texas title, similar to the green monster?

After I spoke to you while I was on the road to El Paso, I suspected that I might be in for what I am going through, but I still don't think it's a big deal (unless the Insurance company refuses to issue the bond due to prior claims or liens against the vehicle, which is highly unlikely.

BTW- that chat with you was very helpful in another way- I would have found it very suspicious that Texas does not require a notary stamp on the signed title when ownership is transferred... so thanks for letting me know that is a normal practice.
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Red 65 hardtop 4L60-002565 (scrapped for parts)
66 Hardtop "El-Bondo Patrol", L60-00511 (Restored, then sold June2020)
Blue 67 Hardtop (sold March1997)
Green 62 Softtop L60-2-00504 (undergoing restoration)
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Re: Documentation/registration paperwork nightmares

Post by zed »

The California title had the L60-XXXXX number as stamed on the ID plate and frame. The State of Texas used the same number on the title.
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Re: Documentation/registration paperwork nightmares

Post by RiverPatrol »

I had a problem getting Togo titled in CA. The title from WY had the VIN as KL60-XXXXX instead of L60-XXXXX. That created a problem. Plus, I wanted the title to state the manufacturer as Nissan instead of Datsun. I had to take Togo to the DMV and have them do a VIN inspection on it. I pointed out that it didn't say Datsun anywhere on the vehicle, so they changed it from Datsun to NIssan. It was a hassle though, so I haven't tried it on any other Patrols.

CA doesn't require a title to be notarized THANK GOD. So I have found many ways around the DMV process. I also now have a friend that is a licensed DMV inspector, so I just email him whatever info I want the Patrol to be titled with and he sends me a completed inspection form. I buy him lunch. :D

I have found that playing dumb and having all the paperwork correctly filled out is the best approach with DMV. I have imported 2 Patrols from different countries. I got my friend to do the inspections; I created a bill of sale from a fictitious owner (in CA); filled out a request for new title (the previous owner lost the title in a fire); had a statement of facts from the previous owner that the vehicle has sat at such-n-such address for 10 years and hasn't been driven on any roads or highways. Of course everything is signed by the previous owner also. ;) I hand all of the documents to the DMV clerk, they comment on how nice it is to have all the correct paperwork, I pay my fees and they give me license plates. A couple of weeks later I get a title in the mail. Done deal.

One of my Patrols had actually been registered in Mexico for a while. Needless to say I didn't show that paperwork to the DMV clerk.

When I got the Dream Garage Patrol there was no title with it. I didn't know the status of the title or if there was any back fees due. So I went in to Auto Club (I use them instead of waiting in line at the DMV) and handed the clerk the license and the VIN number. I said I was contemplating buying the vehicle but I wanted to know if there were any overdue fees due on it. She looked up the info only to fid that the vehicle wasn't on record. It had dropped from the system. So I got my paperwork in order and went back to Auto Club and got it titled and registered using the same scenario as above.

I could have registered these Patrols as any year I wanted them to be since I wasn't providing a previous title. The 2 trucks are titled as '69s to prevent any question with smog regulations, although they are both from the 70s. I could have registered Dream Garage Patrol as a 62, like the poster says, but I didn't.

Once you get the inspection done, it's very easy to get the title process done. Here in CA even a law enforcement officer can do the inspection. You should be familiar with DMV's requirements though, because they will stop the title process if the inspection isn't filled out right. I have actually gone out and found a Sheriff nearby and asked him to come to my house and do an inspection. He did.

It's not hard to get creative, even as tight as DMV tries to be. ;)
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Re: Documentation/registration paperwork nightmares

Post by moore_rb »

Yowza-

From now on, I'm just going to have RP title all my vehicles for me in California, and then transfer them to Az.

HAH - my red Patrol and Dream Garage Patrol both seem to be 65's, maquerading as 62's...
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L-R:
White 65 Hardtop L60-3-00617 (undergoing restoration)
Red 65 hardtop 4L60-002565 (scrapped for parts)
66 Hardtop "El-Bondo Patrol", L60-00511 (Restored, then sold June2020)
Blue 67 Hardtop (sold March1997)
Green 62 Softtop L60-2-00504 (undergoing restoration)
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Re: Documentation/registration paperwork nightmares

Post by Tknc »

Now thats timing, i just called the NC DMV to ask what it is going to take to tittle my Patrol. Of course I had to leave a message. I will post more when I hear back from them. River patrol, was the chassi I recieved from you ever tittled in CA?
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Re: Documentation/registration paperwork nightmares

Post by RiverPatrol »

Tknc wrote:Now thats timing, i just called the NC DMV to ask what it is going to take to tittle my Patrol. Of course I had to leave a message. I will post more when I hear back from them. River patrol, was the chassi I recieved from you ever tittled in CA?
No, I never even received a title for it. It came from NE, but it had TX plates on it. So it was probably last titled in TX.

Go to the web site for NC DMV and see if they have instructions for titling vehicles in various situations, like lost title, transfer of ownership, out of state title, etc. You should be able to piece together a good story. ;)
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Re: Documentation/registration paperwork nightmares

Post by Tknc »

Thank you RP, I got a contact at the DMV that a friend has used before, so that is who I called and left a message with. And yes you are right, I guess I can put together a good story....
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Re: Documentation/registration paperwork nightmares

Post by faux40 »

DMV is always scary! My 67 soft top and the green, topless 66 are registered and non-op'd, unlike my most recent acquisition, the 66 hardtop. It's from a scrap yard and aside from the bill of sale, there's no DMV paperwork... Not sure how this will work out!

In contrast, my 67 hardtop is currently registered and licensed! I could drive it today... if it weren't missing the trans, transfercase, front seat (still need one of these... hint, hint!) and the reason why the previous owner pulled off the oil pan. The important point is that I COULD drive it today per DMV! This beast will stay fully registered so I won't have to deal with the DMV on it. The insurance company, on the other hand, seems a bit confused about what it is and how to rate it!

Best of luck to everyone dealing with registration!

John
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